Beta 3: Questions

[VernJensen]

I have some proposed changes to gameplay that I'd like to get opinions on. First, I've noticed while playing through Mt. Peril today that some of the puzzles Tobin created years ago are now messed up somewhat with the new jumping mechnic. That is, moving platforms affect jack's vertical momentum when he jumps from them. Example rooms for you to consider with the editor (from Mt. Peril):

16900 -- Jumping from the lower-left platform to the upper-right one is now much harder, since you're performing the jump while the platform is moving down.

16898 - The final jump in from platform to the upper-right area is similar.


And yet, the vertical momentum is *required* for the very fast moving platforms that go between rooms in other parts of the mansion. (The elevators that go up/down between rooms.) If Jack jumps on these without the additional momentum, he will jump right through the platform (it moves up right through him) or he will fall to his death on it.

So my ideas are:

A) Reduce the effect of the vertical momentum for slower platforms, so they don't affect Jack's momentum as much.
B) Eliminate it entirely, for the slower platforms.

But the question is, would this create inconsistent gameplay, where sometimes Jack's jumping behaves one way, and other times, it behaves an entirely different way?

[VernJensen]

My second question is related to

ladder jumps

. I had *no idea* you could jump off of a ladder *going down* with no platform under it. Very bizarre behavior that I would consider to be a bug. Same for ladder jumps going off ladders at the top, except custom mansion designers have made this a part of their mansions.

But... no custom mansions have been created for MM2 yet. I'd like to fix these bugs. But if I do, will people kick and scream at me?

[hawaii]

0437203C18373C21373C520 wrote:
But the question is, would this create inconsistent gameplay, where sometimes Jack's jumping behaves one way, and other times, it behaves an entirely different way?

Very keen observation Vern!
Of course it would. A player gets the feel of Jacks behaviour early in the game and expects the same throughout the play. I too experienced the same, but I decided not to mention it, in the event I was told that it was due to my inexperience as a player or that this is what the designer wants.

[hawaii]

487B6C70547B706D7B701E0 wrote: My second question is related to

ladder jumps

. I had *no idea* you could jump off of a ladder *going down* with no platform under it. Very bizarre behavior that I would consider to be a bug. Same for ladder jumps going off ladders at the top, except custom mansion designers have made this a part of their mansions.

But... no custom mansions have been created for MM2 yet. I'd like to fix these bugs. But if I do, will people kick and scream at me?

Yes they will & so will I.  Why?  Because as you already pointed out, CM designers have incorporated that play (bug as you call it) into their MANY CM Mansions and removing now, would screw up the trend. 
People will not know when to use it and when not to use it in the mansions that they play.  And posting which mansions have it & which don't would be an effort in futility, as the information would be lost in the mire of future posts.  Nespa?
Personally, I like it now that I have gotten use to it.  So I vote to keep is as it is.  It makes for an interesting play. 

[Wingy]

I think the game could use without it. Since the game never intended that ladder jumps being able to happen in the first place, it shouldn't be there.

People could argue since it's always been there it should stay and it's become a 'trend' or 'tradition' that previous MM custom mansion designers have incorporated into their harder mansions, but really it was a flaw that people found and Vern never found the urge to fix it.

Personally I think using the ladder jumping technique is cheating, especially if you're in a built-in mansion. Take Leofani Mansion Hard, for example-- the gold/silver block puzzle below the house can be beaten with much less intended difficulty due to this.

Now we may have some people who will indeed kick and scream, but it really comes down to it was never intended. It is something players have found out by themselves, and was never mentioned in the tutorial about it at all. I would also think that most casual MM players have never known about this 'exploit' and try to figure out a way around the puzzle without knowing it in certain original custom mansions.

Ultimately, it should go in MM2. Keep it in MM1 because there are many custom mansions that wouldn't be possible without it.

As for horizontal momentum affecting puzzles in Mt. Peril, I wouldn't worry about that really, because I can fix those bugs.

[VernJensen]

Already took it out Missy. ;-) Just decided it should go, before even reading your response. I guess people probably will kick and scream, but I agree with Anthony -- MM2 is a good time for the

feature

to be removed.

It'll stay in MM1, so all the custom mansions already designed with it in mind can keep using it.

Vertical momentum -- still haven't decided what to do about this yet. I'm still tempted to have it apply less when the platform is slower, and be as-is for faster platforms.... but will have to test things a bit.